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Goldenthrush
(Stranger)
01/05/08 06:52 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: MatrixWorkz]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

No no no, this isn't a good time to be divided.  Take everyone's points and rather than worrying over who's being hypocritical or purist donater or whatever, and look for a solution that will work for at least MOST of the people here. 

I'm no altruist, I like making money from my hobby, but I'm just a good with barter or praise.  (Okay, money's better, this is an expensive hobby!  XD).  

File hosting is expensive, and that is usually paid for out of pocket and by ads.  There's the main point of barter.  Hosting for the content.  Content for the ads.  

Then there is a share of the ad revenue going to the content creators, which is cool.  Means we don't have to worry about shops and that sort of thing.  And some of us don't feel comfortable with selling our stuff for whatever reason.  

This is abused by people, which happens.  But there are rules against it.  So how about some additional rules?  

No works in progress, or works in progress should be exempt from the share program.

Texture tiles must be in sets, blocks of tiles should be uploaded in batches of (say) 50-100.  

Enforce the other rules.

That's just off the top of my head, two things that seem to be in contention and a big part of the problem.

Seriously though, dividing up camps isn't going to help.  The people who are abusing the system sure aren't going to pop in here, they're going to bail like rats leaving a sinking ship, and likely will not remove their content at all in the hopes they'll get money off of it later anyhow.  

There's a lot of very intelligent and well spoken people here right now, I think that differing reasons for using this service can be successfully combined to make it into something that works for all of us, the content providers, the site owners, and the ad sales people.  

Solutions!  

And no, I don't intend to remove my stuff, I was lucky I could figure out how to upload it in the first place.  XD   

 





spacenewt
(Newbie)
01/05/08 07:16 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: Goldenthrush]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I've been making freebies almost since I figured out how to use poser, without looking for any rewards other than experience and maybe a bit of encouraging feedback.

I'd be lying if I said that to get a bit of pocketmoney for them wasn't nice, it really was Laughing but it isn't the main reason I now post my freestuff here... it's the free hosting.

So I'll continue putting me freebies up here as long as the hosting's free.

And to throw my twopennorth into the ideas ring..... why not just pay people for stuff that is actualy downloaded rather than for page views..... that way the customer(so to speak) would basicly be the one deciding who gets a payout.





onnetz
(Stranger)
01/05/08 07:41 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: Goldenthrush]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Maybe I'm missing somthing, or everyone else in this thread is. I'm still not sure wich it is. :-)

 Are we talking about how to get the revenue back or just cleaning the place up to be an elitist 3d community?

Better content is not going to help generate revenue through ads. Neither is combining 100 textures into 1 file.  If anything it will create less page views and in turn less ad revenue.

I fail to see how you can have both. Your not going to get all high quality free items without some kind of incentive.. Hell, rendo can't even do that in its marketplace, much less freestuff. 

As for the ads revenue not being enough, theyve stated that the problem is that international views or clicks dont count. How to fix that is beyond me other than trying to get international ads in here.  Or at least switching out the ones that dont pay for ones that will.





WalkerofShadows
(Stranger)
01/05/08 08:19 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

For myself, I intend to stick around as well.

Sure, the idea of making a little money for the stuff I posted was nice, but to me, the free hosting is far more important. Especially hosting that is so much easier to use for both uploaders and downloaders.

For suggestions, I don't have much. I do think that the idea of paying per download instead of per page view as someone else suggested would be a smarter plan. It would encourage quality since if it's junk, no one will download and with IP tracking, it would be a little harder to abuse I would think.

On the quality issue though, I've been wondering lately why you don't see any groups for Freestuff creators like there are for merchants. Or at least none that I've heard of. Perhaps if one was created, while it wouldn't do a thing about those who are just in this for the quick buck, if done right it could be highly useful for those who want to put out quality work.

*shrugs* Just a thought. 





MatrixWorkz
(Enthusiast)
01/05/08 08:28 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: Goldenthrush]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I don't mind hearing an opposing point of view. I just don't think people who are saying things like "Oh they just wanted all our stuff to generate views for their ad revenue to grow large enough they could skate on it and dump the providers" are precisely the ones who are here to abuse the system.

I provided my freebies from my own paid hosting for 5 years before closing my site due to financial issues. Finding a free host has been the best way to keep my freebies available. Getting paid for it made it better, but it's no reason to pull my freebies if I'm not being paid. Where's the "Share" in that?

The people who are just here to earn are not here to share which in and of itself is not at all the spirit of what the site was purported to be. A Place to share your freebies with others. Emphasis on Sharing! Not Earning. 



It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


Jumpstartme2
(Journeyman)
01/05/08 09:07 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: MatrixWorkz]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Actually, if it comes down to the technical, ShareCG started off this community by offering to pay uploaders because they felt the freestuff providers deserved to be compensated...and they said so in the first page, in the top paragraph of the Learn More area:

 

"Does ShareCG really pay me for uploading my CG art, animations, tutorials, 3d models, and other resources?

Yes. All over the web, CG professionals, artists, and hobbyists are sharing their content with the world for free. The sites they choose to share it on are the real ones that benefit, though, making thousands with advertising. We believe that those that make the art, tutorials, and downloads deserve their fair share."

 

And this is what drew most everyone in...not only because its was a free host, and easy to navigate..

I personally don't care about the money...but I do care about the direction the site is going. Alot of questions. 

When I discovered ShareCG, I was looking for a software program etc that I could put on my own domain so I could run a freebie area, and a store of my own, {once I got good enough to begin selling items}....I'm still looking, and have been the entire time I have been here.

If I find what I'm looking for, I may leave my items here, and at my place too, or I might pull everything and move it there exclusively...doesn't mean I'm jumping ship because I'm not being paid tho..I never really got that much to begin with ~shrugs~

Been some good ideas I have seen here...keep those thinking caps on ;) 

 

 





joypauline
(Journeyman)
01/05/08 09:38 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: MatrixWorkz]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Yes indeed Steve. ShareCG has provided so many with a good hosting site and it is a shame that some are thinking of jumping ship. People here are so lucky in being able upload their freestuff. Being in the UK, I have had so many problems uploading (takes several attempts and much time lost) and cannot spare the time it takes.

Be thankful for such a good hosting site that allows your work to be previewed in formats other than tiny thumbnails.

It is sad that some individuals cannot accept or see that they have abused the site. The only solution that I can see is to have moderators. This can be controversial...but we live in the real world....and we are all subject to scrutiny in what we do. What is so wrong with a group of diverse people determining the usefulness of material posted here???? I am all for moderation if admin can afford it.

Good luck everyone!!!





jakehellerModerator
(Member)
01/05/08 10:52 PM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: karanta]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Thank you for all your comments, and we really appreciate all the people saying that they are going to stay with us. Like many of you, we are also disappointed that the original revenue sharing system didn’t work out. We are considering alternatives, and I hope those with opinions will voice them in the discussion started by Dadchamp here: http://www10.sharecg.com/wwwthreads-5.3/showflat.php?Cat=8,9,10,11,12&Board=suggestions&Number=87901&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0∂=1&vc=1

 

There were a few people who made four basic arguments, which I will respond to here:

 

1. The site gets revenue from ads, and that revenue should be shared

While it's true that the site gets revenue from ads, remember that we have to pay our staff, as well as servers, office space, etc.

But in principle, we still agree that artists deserve to get the benefits of their hard work. That's why we're going to work our hardest to return to revenue sharing, but with a more sensible system that won't drown the website in illegitimate, copyright, or low quality posts.

2. There are no benefits to sharing on the site other than revenue
I know our site needs improvements, but as it stands, I think we offer a pretty good deal. You can upload an unlimited amount of files, up to 180MB each, and we'll host it for you for free. We make it easily searchable by tool type, category, format, etc. We give you an audience of hundreds of thousands of artists a month, where you can get helpful feedback and start a discussion about your work, which will ultimately help you become a better artist.

We are involved in an overall effort to beautify our site—making it easier to use, leave feedback, and a better place to showcase your work. In the near future, we will introduce our jobs system, which will allow you to use our website to submit a resume to hundreds of employers. We're going to introduce a Flash portfolio application, which you can use to present your art, animations, tutorials, or even freebies and embed in your resumes for the job system on our site.

3. If we enforced the rules, there would be no problems
First, one of the largest problems was the quality of uploads on the site, but the line between what is and isn't art, and what should or should not be showcased on our site, is too difficult to draw. We hoped the rating system and view counts would help the quality posts float to the top, but for whatever reason (and perhaps because people were driven by money, not wanting to leave feedback) it never really worked.

Second, the copyright issue is very complicated, and our staff had to spend hours trying to determine if a 3d Model or Poser freebie violated someone's copyright. Of course this might continue without the payment system, but the incentives made it so that people wanted to cheat the system. We anticipate a significant decrease in copyright infringement after we abolish the payment system.

4. This was a "bait and switch"
We respect our artists, and were never trying to trick them into anything. Please remember that we paid our contributors for every month we had a revenue sharing system, and we informed you when it ended. Our services were always and will continue to be 100% free, and you can easily remove all your content whenever you want.



dadchamp
(Journeyman)
01/06/08 01:21 AM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Community ... Jake my support is behind you 110% as always! I want you to succeed because that means I did my part. And I thank you whole heartedly for providing FREE web space and FREE support for all the items I have uploaded. I have never complained about anything you have done and have always supported ALL of your business decisions. Even this one! Especially THIS ONE!

 HEY, where were all you whiny toads when it was time for making suggestions BEFORE the $#!T hit the fan? It becomes so obvious who the problems are whenever there is a change ... payout rate drops ... people whine and complain. Payout system stops ... same people whine and complain. And always the same ones who are NEVER active in discussions before. If you're not here for the money, just why are you here if the only time we hear from you is when there is a problem WITH the money! Also, do any other sites offer a click button on download pages for DONATIONS? HMMM???? I've gotten about a $150 so far that way.

Matrix is right ... hypocrits. GO somewhere else, you are not welcome here. It is not a community divided, it is a community shaking out the loosers and moochers and moving forward to improve!



--
I don't fear God anymore. Anything he/she can do to me now is only adding insult to injury!


adp__
(Journeyman)
01/06/08 08:48 AM
Re: Revenue Sharing Cancelled new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

The announced business model is why I uploaded my stuff here. I started selling content on some sites including Renderosity 5 years ago. With great success, by the way. But I stopped because of several reasons. The main reason: I wanted to make content, not "Poser-Packages" and advertising pages. So I looked for another way but the usual Poser stores.

There is a lot of crap that is sold in stores. It's hard to say if a product is useable or not just from the advertising pages (some producers are better with creating advertising pictures and icons than creating content). My idea with this site was: Try before you buy. Good content free for non-commercial use. And I bet: I'm not the only one with something similar in mind (providing things for free to make money as soon as possible).

This times all sort of digital content is what a classic product was before. This is the reason why strong copyrights are implemented. For music, videos, pictures and even digital 3D-products. Most new business models are made around products created for free from others (called Web 2). ShareCG's original business model is the only fair model with a good chance for the long run, IMHO.

I'm a content creator and I'm interested to make money at the end. Similar to what ShareCG has in mind. Doing something good to the people while staying in business.

ShareCG's problem is not the business model itself. The site owners are just not able to implement it.

There are some basics (web standards) common for all business sites on the web. Nothing special, nothing new, nothing fancy. Forget about the dream of "easy access without email-verification". Forget about a working rating system. Forget about a high quality community (there are enough other places doing this job better - you aren't able to force it). And: Forget about the dream of "no control". Concentrate on the only UPS (unique point of sale) you have: Your advertised business model.

Accept that Poser content is what pays the bills. You may be able to develop this site to another direction - but not tomorrow, not next week. People making videos or music will find a mutch, mutch bigger audience on YouTube and other places. "Real 3D artists" are homed on well known other sites. You are left with a million of Poser users - take them.

Your offer: Storage for free content - isn't that attractive. Storage and traffic becomes cheaper every day (internet providers offer "unlimited traffic" starting from 10 Euro per month). There are a lot of other places to store a ZIP file.

As said here before from others: If content providers are invited to become paid "valueable members", the SPAM problem is mostly solved. If only downloads are counted and a download requires to enter a code before it starts, cheating isn't possible anymore. For other things (including copyright issues): Make sure "Flag as Inappropriate" works. There are enough people around having an eye on anything uploaded.

Anything happend to this site isn't new or surprising. So just make sure you have at least one people in your stuff with a good knowledge about the common basics to create a business site.

Good luck,
Fredi Hartmann




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