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Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
10/31/07 03:57 AM
quality Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Just thinking, it might be an idea to implement the kind of quality control in place at CGSociety. An artist can put anything they like in their own gallery but for their image to be included in the main gallery it has to be accepted via some moderator decision. I'm a professional digital illustrator but so far I've only uploaded a couple of images because of the general quality of the images here (bloody awful Poser things) because I'm wary of being involved with a site that seems to promote so many awful images.

I'm not knocking people who are making an effort, just the ones that seem to

 post images with no obvious effort involved.

Anyway, just a thought :) 

 





joypauline
(Journeyman)
10/31/07 06:03 AM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Hmmmmmmmmmmm....I get your point....but you are rather vague. It would be useful if you could be more specific.

"bloody awful Poser things" could mean anything. Are you suggesting that all Poser users produce awful "stuff"????? I have seen some quality here and often from hobbyists who do not have the privilege of working in the industry.

Just trying to clarify what you mean?

Cheers

 





Panthia
(Newbie)
10/31/07 09:26 AM
Re: quality new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I just went and had a lookie at just poser art and there happens to be tons and tons and tons of excellent images! 



joypauline
(Journeyman)
10/31/07 10:51 AM
Re: quality new [re: Panthia]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I totally agree with you Panthia. That is why I responded to this post which, seemed to be suggesting that Poser work is poor quality. I am sure the poster did not mean to give that impression so I asked for clarification. I have downloaded some excellent quality material from this area.

Cheers





MatrixWorkz
(Member)
10/31/07 11:35 AM
Re: quality new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Welcome to the World of CGSociety snobbery. Poser users are treated as the red headed step child of CGI on that site and that's why you don't see many Poser works there. One because once an image is identified as a Poser image it is immediately attacked and two because most seasoned Poser users have no use for a site that denigrates everything they do.


It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


joypauline
(Journeyman)
10/31/07 12:34 PM
Re: quality new [re: MatrixWorkz]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Yes I see that Steve and, what snobbery it is!!!!!...e.g. good animation in Poser is a very time-consuming and demands skill...unless you just us a pre-applied file (which still needs much tweeking) and very few exist.

I really do not understand this snobbery as I have a colleague/friend who worked on Roger Rabbit as an animator and swears by Poser as an animating tool! He would knock spots of all these snobs but simply takes no notice of their arrogance.

Hugs

Pauline

 





jakehellerModerator
(Journeyman)
10/31/07 01:33 PM
Re: quality new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Although I definitely don't want to inherit the snobbery of CGSociety, I think that Lobster's idea ain't bad. It would really help remove from our galleries those users who are uploading massive quantities of very easily made content with almost no artistic qualities, while at the same time still allowing them to upload on the site, and those items will be available in their "portfolios" (as we currently call it... which is essentially a list of their files... we're going to have *real* portfolios soon).

The idea would be that being in our galleries is a priviledge, while uploading to the site is a right (well, unless it's [censored], copyright, etc). 

One problem is that it's a huge moderation issue--and who moderates? We'll have to give it more thought, but I think this is actually a pretty good idea.

-Jake 





Panthia
(Newbie)
10/31/07 01:50 PM
Re: quality new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

hahahahahahahaha

 Ok....I'll admit the idea of your artwork making to a privileged section would be great.  It would make me feel awesome and would clean out all those poser 'art' works of cyclo backs with an animal stuck in there......

 Not saying my renders that I've posted there are any of the greats but atleast they did take some time to do and aren't 'hopefully' generic in nature!





MatrixWorkz
(Member)
10/31/07 01:53 PM
Re: quality new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I agree, the idea was excellent. I just didn't appreciate the bash to Poser that came with it. That was uncalled for.

Private upload areas that aren't included in view counts sounds like an excellent idea. It would give us a place to upload thumbnails of our works to link to from other sites. Right now I use a different site completely for my thumbnails and WIP's. One stop shopping here would be a plus for me. Laughing



It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


pauljs75
(Stranger)
10/31/07 02:52 PM
Re: quality new [re: jakeheller]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

A portion of Poser complaints do have merit though. Who really does want to see yet another "Nekkid Vicky in a temple" type shot with a stock pose, so-so lighting, and a vacant expressionless face? It's that which gives Poser a bad rap...

But like any other CG app, I see it as a tool. If somebody takes the time to develop a scene and put some life into the character(s), then it does have potential. There are Poser works that come off brilliantly. I think the real complaint is that such pieces are rare in comparison to the typical fluff seen in most Poser/D|S gallerys.





MatrixWorkz
(Member)
10/31/07 03:18 PM
Re: quality new [re: pauljs75]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

"A portion of Poser complaints do have merit though."

Not enough merit that the entirety of all Poser art should be painted with the same brush. I've seen 3D Studio and other high end application work that can be called junk as well, but I don't make offensive blanket statements about the application and it's users. 



It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


Panthia
(Newbie)
10/31/07 03:24 PM
Re: quality new [re: pauljs75]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I'm one of those peeps who for a long time was too scared to mess with posing.....well....all it took was a little playing and while my initial pose may be a generic from a pose pack I'm learning to tweak and everything else to get it to exactly what I wanted. 

Matrix....I vote for you to moderate whats good and whats not and what should be considered 'priveleged' art!  muhahahahahahahahahaha 

 





MatrixWorkz
(Member)
10/31/07 03:27 PM
Re: quality new [re: Panthia]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Curse you Panthia! I decline the nomination. Tongue out  Seriously, I don't need that kind of stress in my life. That and if I had to rate everything on this site, I'd never have time to do any of my own submissions.

It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


HoboBo
(Stranger)
10/31/07 03:34 PM
Re: quality new [re: Panthia]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Dear Panthia,

 Now I have deleted my  "  cyclo backs with an animal stuck in there......"

from the "art"  category. 



HoboBo


Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
11/01/07 03:18 AM
Re: quality new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Yes, that does sound awfully snobbish doesn't it?  What I meant when I mentioned Poser are the images containing a simple Poser figure and standard props. I don't include everything with those criteria, some of these images can be very imaginative. But there are those that are not. I've also seen some good use of Poser where the artist has put obvious thought and planning into the image and used Poser to bring their idea to life.

What I object to are the images where it's appears that the artist has sat in front of Poser, picked a standard pose, added some standard clothing and lighting and then posted it.  I don't have a problem with people creating these images, I just think that these images would be better placed in a personal gallery where it would be the viewers choice whether to look through them all.

Whether it's considered elitist or not, higher quality images in the public gallery

 would attract more viewers and artists within the industry.

If you want to be sure of seeing higher quality images, where would you go,

CGSociety or Deviant art?(for example) Yes, you can find high quality images on Deviant Art but they're a lot harder to find.

I suppose it all depends on what kind of site you want to create.





Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
11/01/07 03:18 AM
Re: quality *DELETED* new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Post deleted by Lobsterhead


Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
11/01/07 03:26 AM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I suppose I might get attacked for bashing Deviant art now :) I'm not, I'm just trying to make a point. Apologies to any Poser artists who feel I'm attacking their art, that's not my intention.



joypauline
(Journeyman)
11/01/07 04:54 AM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Yes....I did get the feeling that you did NOT intend to come across in a "snobbish" manner. That is why I asked what you REALLY meant. Irrespective of the programme used, there will always be poor and outstanding works. As another poster has stated, I have seen poor quality from Max and Maya....Poser is just the same.

At the end of the day it all depends upon what you are trying to achieve with the software. If it is "fit for purpose", then it can be brilliant.

Unfortunately, many galleries and sites show Poser images based on the fantasy world. This is fine of course, but it can become a little boring. Poser has such potential for so many uses. I have used its animation features for educational purposes and that has a specific purpose. I will not be competing with Lord of the Rings or Turner!!!.......it serves this alternate purpose so well.

But...there are people who seem to be able to use Poser with great skill and I so admire them. This programme can be very under-rated and this is such a shame. I remember the days when I had to provide images for my students on gestetners and then get all covered with ink when I printed them out.

Perhaps we are just so spoilt these days cos we have such brilliant tools at our disposal.

I say Poser rocks and I thanks all those users who have inspired me!!!!

Cheers



irishlostboy
(Newbie)
11/01/07 05:24 PM
Re: quality new [re: joypauline]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

now that poser bashing and lobsterhead bashing is sorted out, how about get back to the subject at hand. quality control. is there a fix, or are we just creating another deviantart type place full of egos and "expression" ( i am allowed to burn deviantart. i have been a member there for years)

i dont want to have to go over to turbosquid, but i think one deviantart is enough.  



http://irishlostboy.deviantart.com/gallery/
http://www.sharecg.com/pf/irishlostboy


Panthia
(Newbie)
11/01/07 05:43 PM
Re: quality new [re: irishlostboy]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

it's kinda like rendo's freebie section.....you have to weed thru the bad and find the good......It's gonna be like that just about anywhere that is freebie related.....And hopefully we'll all be better and there won't be an issue!  I said hopefully!

 I mean heck, I've bought stuff that once I got it, well.....it sucked!





draagonstorm
(Stranger)
11/01/07 06:42 PM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I am so on the fence on all that has been said.

I've been an amatuer artist for to many years then I should admit to Wink. I got into Computer Art 2 or 3 years ago, and 3D (DAZ) in May of this year(2007).

This site has been great for me. I've learned so much here. First by downloading stuff, and then by posted free stuff here. How to and How not to package an item. What people like and don't like... this list can go on... And I have so much more to learn. My goal is to have enough knowledge and skills to actually be at level to 'sell' my work. That would be a great side income when I get to retirement age (not that far away anymore). Plus I love doing this stuff.

And where else would I learn this, then by doing!

If there was a moderation aspect at this site that could say 'no, your stuff isn't good enough for this site', then how would I learn from my mistakes?

But, then again, I can see people are taking advantage of the system here, for obviously the view counts..... one item at a time of the same type of item, instead of zipping them up into one file... I see that in the beginning I can be accused of the same thing... My 'Swap Meet Necklaces', but then again, each necklace at that time took me days to do, and when I finished one I would post it. But I digress.....

I would really hate to see an overall, 'The quality of the work you have uploaded, does not pass our quality control' type of moderation. Maybe more of 'A number of your uploads are of the same type and each are of a size that we feel should be zipped together and then uploaded'

JMHO

DraagonStorm





MatrixWorkz
(Member)
11/01/07 07:51 PM
Re: quality new [re: draagonstorm]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I'd just like to interrupt  your thread for a visual announcement. Here's a Poser Image made using one of my Freebie dresses by a member of Renderosity. I think it's fantastic!

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1552511 



It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Albert Einstein


Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
11/02/07 02:11 AM
Re: quality new [re: MatrixWorkz]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

That's one of the good ones I mentioned, the artist has used Poser to realise an idea.

I would like to point out that I use Poser myself. It's a great tool for reference and trying out different lighting models.

Let me clear something up, I was not suggesting that posts are rejected on the grounds of quality. But in order to prevent galleries being flooded by a multitude of similar images then some kind of moderation is required.

An image should at least have some originality to it, that's all. It doesn't matter 

whether an image is 'good or bad' that's a matter of individual taste, just have some

originality. And why do I keep getting these bloodly blank lines in my text?

 





Lobsterhead
(Stranger)
11/02/07 08:37 AM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

try this one

http://www.e-frontier.com/imagecatalogue/customimageview/4428/?sbss=511

 





Panthia
(Newbie)
11/02/07 10:18 AM
Re: quality new [re: Lobsterhead]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I just realized I ticked HoboBo off again!  I'll stop using him as an example........Honestly not picking on him......

 Matrix....The artist to the image that you posted (Priss)....OMG I love her.  Got to know her in a msn poser group and she is such a wonderful person!  And if you check out her whole gallery at rendo....well.....I think she's excellent!

Lobster.....I totally agree with you that no image should be rejected.....just duplicate type and so on should be in a personal gallery.....I mean I know that there are those who are just beginning who are learning and I definitely don't want to discourage them and their learning.  I was there and on many levels I'm still there.  I mean heck....I can have one image that I think totally rocks and then the next 10 that suck butt.......

 

And I would totally love some constructive critizism on my work...............






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